Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Powerhead issues - information

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Powerhead issues - information

    So, guyz, it has been painful to see all the posts about blown powerheads, especially seeing John Hutchins post where apparently Garry and I passed him when he was having issues without noticing a request for help....

    So, I had done research earlier before I bought my boat with the 4 stroke and I've done some more last night and I wanted to share it with you.

    The way they mix ethanol based gas is to fill up the tanker with gas, then fill it up with the right amount of ethanol and let the trucks motion during the delivery mix it up (read this, so take it with a grain of salt, but believable)....

    With that as a background, I found a conversation a bass club had and the research they did and here is the net. They had a bunch of blown powerhead issues and decided to do some homework. They had all the gas stations they used to fill their boat up tested. The results were amazing and the problems were immediately known. Some of the gas that got tested turned out to be close to 50% ethanol. The ranges were all over the map and their research lead to them finding out what I stated above. So, since they now only use gas from stations that get quality gas, their problems have stopped. This problem is primarily with 2 stroke engines.

    Now, other information. If you go to the Mercury site (I did), they explicitly say that if you use gas with more than 10% ethanol, your warrenty is VOID. E85 is verbotten. Apparently, besides the issues with alcohol and it being a solvent on your internal gaskets and fuel tanks, but it fools the O2 sensor and causes your engine to run LEAN...hense, blown powerheads.....

    Advice on some sites besides finding quality gas (High Point sells non ethanol gas), is to use Synthetic Oil in the 2 strokes as it will insulate the piston better than non synthetic oil...Just repeating my research here, but it seems to be repeated often enough to believe (more expensive I am sure).

    I found a place where you can buy your own fuel testers, so I am going to buy a couple, as I want to check out the sheetz new Leesylvania State Park. I noticed my boat runs hotter on the Potomac than Lake Anna and the difference is where I have been buying my gas....

    Here is a link to the fuel test kits:

    http://www.fuel-testers.com/

    Here is another link talking about the problems.

    http://www.evinrude-parts.com/boat_e...recaution.html

    I think there is a problem here guys, and it is NOT Mercury, or Yamaha or Evinrudes problem other than maybe they should just build an engine that can hand MUCH higher levels of Ethanol due to what appears to be rampant quality problems at Gas Stations.
    cheers,
    Steve

    2011/2013 St Jude's Charity Tournament Champion
    Bass East Big Bass Challenge winner of 11-12 and 12-1 hours.

    sigpic

  • #2
    I may be wrong but i think they are passing a law or already passed a law to allow more ethonal in gas. Probably 70% ish of my boat gas comes from the BP in Louisa, it has ethanol, I run marine stable always. I havent had any trouble yet but my motor is just a 2001 merc 125 2 stroke. I believe the motor manufacturers are going to have to do something to be able to run ethanol in new motors - it aint going away.
    sigpic

    CHUCK n DUCK

    Comment


    • #3
      That's why most new vehicles you see on the market these days are "Flex Fuel". I am in the market for a new truck soon and most all of them are "Flex Fuel", which means they can burn anything with Ethanol E10 to E85. So...they are covering their a$$es.
      2013 Frog Only Tournament Winner
      2010 Tie for VA-Outdoors Angler of the Year
      2009 Caroline County Rotary Club Tournament Winner
      2007 Tuesday Night Classic Champions
      "Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after."
      sigpic

      Comment


      • #4
        Steve, It may be WaWa you are refering to near Lees. Park instead of Sheetz. It is the one at the corner of Rt. 1. I think all gas stations should have an option of what kind of gas you buy. I have already replaced one fuel line because of ethanol.
        Rob
        1st Place VA East FOMNTT Potomac River 2006, VA East FOMNTT Big Bag 2006, VAO Frog Only Tournament Winner 2011

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks Steve, thats good information. I think I'll get a couple of test kits.
          Kirk
          sigpic

          Comment


          • #6
            Rob,

            You are absolutely correct, it is WaWa's, or as JayT calls it, the Worlds Busiest WaWa's ;)
            I can't believe we live in a world where gas stations can provide such poorly mixed product, cause 10's of thousands of dollars in damage to our personal property, and a bunch of lawsuits have not emerged......
            cheers,
            Steve

            2011/2013 St Jude's Charity Tournament Champion
            Bass East Big Bass Challenge winner of 11-12 and 12-1 hours.

            sigpic

            Comment


            • #7
              Squire,

              Your research on how they blend the Ethanol and Gasoline is 100% correct. It is not done by a metering valve at all it is what we call in the fire service "batch mixing". I am one of the team leaders for our Hazardous Materials Response Team at work and have done alot of studing on this subject as it effects the fire service in responding to incidents. It has caused us much problems also in the way of how we mitigate incidents dealing with fires and spills.

              I have talked to guys that work in and around the fuel depots where they load the trucks and the fill first with gasoline and the the ethanol is then pumped into the truck. The gas and ethanol is stored in two different tanks at the tank farms.

              Another big problem with ethanol is that it loves water and two stroke motors hate water. I lost the powerhead in my merc two years ago and it was partially due to the ethanol. Stabil has the additive for the ethanol based fuels now and alot of guys i talk to swear by the sea foam also.

              There are alot of studies out their today that shows that this mix's of gas and ethanol at gas stations are more than 10%. The EPA just recently approved the percentages to go up to 15%.

              So good luck to everyone out there.

              Keith
              www.shenandoahvalleybass.com

              sigpic
              sigpic

              Comment


              • #8
                A 15% ratio was approved but only for newer vehicles. It is still not approved for older cars, trucks, and 2 strokes. The one manufacturing area that was caught with thier pants down has been the rubber market. They have been slow to respond in making ethonol resistant gaskets, fuel lines, o-rings etc but they are slowly catching up. Most of the rubber products that I am buying now are ethonol resistan so there is hope for the future. I see the same problems at work on all equipment from chain saws to dozers. Oh, by the way. CA started this crap in the first place and its stupid anyway to take your food and make fuel.
                2010 VAO Polar Bear Overall Winner
                2010 VAO Polar Bear Big Striper


                sigpic

                Comment


                • #9
                  We are lucky on this side on the mountain as there are several stations that carry pure gasoline. You do pay a little more for it but it is nice to have that flexibility. Most of these places are small mom and pops owned places i would believe the fed as regulated if you sell over as certain amount of fuel you must sell the ethanol fuel, but i am not totally sure on that.
                  sigpic

                  We are told that we shouldn't judge all Muslims by the actions of an extreme few. Why can't we offer millions of law-abiding American gun owners the same consideration?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Yes just1more you are very right. I have seen the same in the automotive industry. But I'm not sure about the powerheads blowing and the O2 sensors leaning the engines out. I would think that it would be the other way around. Ethanol burns much cleaner and there has to be gasoline in the mix or the engine would not run. Plus in a two stroke engine the O2 sensors can not be this sensative becuse of the oil that is not being burned in the combustion chamber that is contaminating the O2 sensors. I think as in autos,all build junk but some build more junk than others.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I wanted to let the vao team know my little secret. if you run a carb 2 stroke or a merc optimax/xs or pro xs you can add oil to the gas when you fill up. I keep a squirt bottle in the boat and put about 3 squirts(maybe 1oz per squirt)to every 10gallons of gas. it is just a little thing i do for added protection. I have replaced my fuel lines in my 97 johnson and also in a 04 merc efi and the 07 pro xs. I think the fuel lines are a direct result of the ethanol in the gas but NEVER had a blown power head. If you have a 4 stroke do NOT do this.
                      bfelts
                      sigpic

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X